Why the last minute reluctance to sign the visa waiver agreement?
There is no reluctance.
So why was it put on hold?
Because the processes of signing the document were not yet completed.
Weren't you scheduled to sign it on Monday with your Ukrainian counterpart?
Yes, but the processes within the government to enable us to effect the signing were not completed.
Didn't you say officials had agreed on the text and that it was ready to be signed?
Yes, I did say that. What that means is that all officials from both Dirco and home affairs and also from Ukraine, they first negotiate the facts of the agreement, then when they have agreed and negotiated they take it through the processes of government for signatures by all the relevant parties. Which is what was not completed.
Why was your Ukrainian counterpart in Pretoria on Monday if the agreement was not ready to be signed?
He was in Pretoria for a political engagement to deepen the bilateral [relationship] of the two countries in a mutually beneficial way.
Was he not in Pretoria for a mutual signing of the agreement?
No, that was not the purpose. Because he was coming here and there was already a process that was started in 2022, we then said let's fast track it so that by the time he arrives and we have this meeting we can use it as an opportunity for him to sign the agreement.
When will it be signed?
Once all the processes have been completed.
How long will that take?
I really can't say.
Isn't there a sense of urgency to have it signed in time for the Ukrainian peace summit this month?
We want it to be done as soon as practically possible because that will help both countries' diplomats to travel to each other's countries and participate in the peace forum.
It would strengthen South Africa's credibility as an impartial mediator if it were signed ahead of the summit, wouldn't it?
We think we have shown our good faith as a non-aligned country. What it will do is make it easier to pursue shuttle diplomacy for peace.
We want it to be done as soon as practically possible because that will help both countries' diplomats to travel to each other's countries and participate in the peace forum
The importance of shuttle diplomacy to peace efforts makes it even harder to understand the delay, doesn't it?
That's why we tried to fast track it so we could conclude it with our counterpart in Pretoria. But unfortunately that could not happen due to circumstances beyond everyone's control.
Did Putin object?
No
Did he and President Ramaphosa talk about it at the recent Brics summit in Russia?
No, there was no need.
So that's not why the signing was delayed?
No, not at all.
Why did home affairs minister Leon Schreiber say last week, as did you, that it was ready to be signed?
I would not know, I can't speak for Mr Schreiber.
How seriously can Ukraine take South Africa as a non-aligned mediator when the president announces just before the peace summit that Russia is a valued ally and friend?
From my engagement with my counterpart from Ukraine it's clear they see us as a very important player in the peace process.
Would you like to comment on this article?
Sign up (it's quick and free) or sign in now.
Please read our Comment Policy before commenting.